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 Posted: Wed Jul 02, 2003 7:07 pm Post subject: I.M.E. Handbook (WAS: Class-1 Magazine question) |
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Jonathan Sivier
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| Posted: Sat Jul 19, 2008 8:23 pm Post subject: Re: Is a wood grain nose cone too UN-rocket? |
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On Fri, 18 Jul 2008 14:00:55 -0700 (PDT), Roger Coppock <rcoppock@adnc.com>
wrote:
| Quote: | So, what to you think.
-- Is a wood grain nose cone too UN-rocket?
-- Should I hide true beauty under black paint just for the
sake of convention?
|
I think a wood grain nose cone could look very good. You may want to change
the rest of the paint job to match it though.
There used to be someone selling rocket kits that were made entirely from
wood, including the body tubes. One of the members of our local rocket club has
a couple of these and flies them from time to time. They are heavy, but look
great. They are unpainted, just a clear coat over the wood.
Jonathan
-----
Jonathan Sivier Secretary, Central Illinois Aerospace
jsivier@uiuc.edu NAR #56437
Flight Simulation Lab Tripoli #1906
Beckman Institute Home Address:
405 N. Mathews 5 The Summit
Urbana, IL 61801 Champaign, IL 61820
217/244-1923 217/359-8225
-----
Home page URL: https://netfiles.uiuc.edu/jsivier/www/ |
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Jilly
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| Posted: Sat Jul 19, 2008 9:46 pm Post subject: Re: Auction - 3 Estes scale kits |
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I have placed 8 more kits up for auction today
Iris - 180267224227
Mini Patriot - 180267224911
Mercury Redstone - 180267220094
Black Brant II -180267221054
Trident II - 180267222466
Trident II - 180267223084
Delta Clipper - 180267226651
ARV Condor - 180267227894 |
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Roger Coppock
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| Posted: Sun Jul 20, 2008 7:33 am Post subject: Re: Is a wood grain nose cone too UN-rocket? |
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On Jul 19, 8:04 pm, Alan Jones <ala...@nospam.mchsi.com> wrote:
| Quote: | On Fri, 18 Jul 2008 14:00:55 -0700 (PDT), Roger Coppock
rcopp...@adnc.com> wrote:
I just finished the nose cone to my certification rocket.
With all the sanding, painting, and drying, it has taken
a week. I had the 7-inch long nose cone specially turned
out of hard balsa wood for me at Balsa Machining Service.
I've painted it with a clear lacquer sanding sealer, which
brought out the wood's grain. True beauty!
Originally, I planned to paint it black. That is my rocket
color scheme, a fluorescent yellow body with black fins and
nose cone. Now, I'm not so sure. I know that this is
supposed to be a MODEL rocket and that the real rockets I
imitate never had solid wooden nose cones.
So, what to you think.
-- Is a wood grain nose cone too UN-rocket?
Certainly not. Even NACA used to fly a lot of research rockets with
wooden noses and other wooden structures.
|
OH?
What NACA research rockets were these?
I may have a talent for modeling them.
Are there any histories, plans or scale data available?
| Quote: | With your color scheme some people might assume that it
originally had a black or yellow nose cone, but that you lost or
damaged it and replaced it with a balsa one.
|
This is quite true, but so long as my certification
judges don't make this mistake, I really don't care. |
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Roger Coppock
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| Posted: Sun Jul 20, 2008 7:38 am Post subject: Re: Is a wood grain nose cone too UN-rocket? |
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On Jul 19, 8:23 am, Jonathan Sivier <jsiv...@illinois.edu> wrote:
| Quote: | On Fri, 18 Jul 2008 14:00:55 -0700 (PDT), Roger Coppock <rcopp...@adnc.com
wrote:
So, what to you think.
-- Is a wood grain nose cone too UN-rocket?
-- Should I hide true beauty under black paint just for the
sake of convention?
I think a wood grain nose cone could look very good. You may want to change
the rest of the paint job to match it though.
There used to be someone selling rocket kits that were made entirely from
wood, including the body tubes.
|
Could you give the name of this defunct vendor and
other details, please.
| Quote: | One of the members of our local rocket club has
a couple of these and flies them from time to time. They are heavy, but look
great. They are unpainted, just a clear coat over the wood.
Jonathan
-----
Jonathan Sivier Secretary, Central Illinois Aerospace
jsiv...@uiuc.edu NAR #56437
Flight Simulation Lab Tripoli #1906
Beckman Institute Home Address:
405 N. Mathews 5 The Summit
Urbana, IL 61801 Champaign, IL 61820
217/244-1923 217/359-8225
-----
Home page URL:https://netfiles.uiuc.edu/jsivier/www/ |
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Alan Jones
Guest
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| Posted: Sun Jul 20, 2008 8:04 am Post subject: Re: Is a wood grain nose cone too UN-rocket? |
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On Fri, 18 Jul 2008 14:00:55 -0700 (PDT), Roger Coppock
<rcoppock@adnc.com> wrote:
| Quote: | I just finished the nose cone to my certification rocket.
With all the sanding, painting, and drying, it has taken
a week. I had the 7-inch long nose cone specially turned
out of hard balsa wood for me at Balsa Machining Service.
I've painted it with a clear lacquer sanding sealer, which
brought out the wood's grain. True beauty!
Originally, I planned to paint it black. That is my rocket
color scheme, a fluorescent yellow body with black fins and
nose cone. Now, I'm not so sure. I know that this is
supposed to be a MODEL rocket and that the real rockets I
imitate never had solid wooden nose cones.
So, what to you think.
-- Is a wood grain nose cone too UN-rocket?
|
Certainly not. Even NACA used to fly a lot of research rockets with
wooden noses and other wooden structures.
| Quote: | -- Should I hide true beauty under black paint just for the
sake of convention?
|
I think you answered your own question;"true beauty". However, beauty
is in the eye of the beholder and others may not be suitably
impressed. With your color scheme some people might assume that it
originally had a black or yellow nose cone, but that you lost or
damaged it and replaced it with a balsa one.
I remember one of my early models, an Estes Vega. I had given the
balsa rocket kit a perfect finish, and painted it white... I showed
it to my uncle, the guy who more or less got me started in modeling,
with some pride, and he was unimpressed. He initially thought that it
was all just prefab RTF plastic. So I guess you might even want to
have some obvious flaws, so that others can recognize your
craftsmanship.
Alan
| Quote: | (You can learn a lot about life while building model rockets.)
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Not so much about life, but rocket building is a discipline, and you
might even learn something about yourself. |
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Roger Coppock
Guest
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| Posted: Sun Jul 20, 2008 8:41 pm Post subject: Re: Is a wood grain nose cone too UN-rocket? |
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Thanks Dwayne.
My nose cone and rocket have circular cross sections.
I don't see how this is on topic.
On Jul 20, 12:31 pm, "Dwayne Surdu-Miller"
<surdumil...@shaw.nospam.ca> wrote:
| Quote: | One defunct rocketry manufacturer that offered all-wood kits was Stellar
Dimensions. A few of their plans are posted at Ye Olde Rocket Shoppe.
Dwayne Surdu-Miller
|
WOW! A square wooden rocket and directions with a short
Sci-Fi story included!?! Stellar Dimensions was more than
an E engine's flight from the mainstream. The available
directions are copyrighted 1996 through 1997. I wonder
how many of these rockets were made and how many survive
today?
http://www.oldrocketplans.com/sdi.htm
http://www.oldrocketplans.com/sdi/sdi203/avenger.pdf
http://www.oldrocketplans.com/sdi/sdi301/SDI_Zanadune.pdf
http://www.oldrocketplans.com/sdi/sdi401/sdi401.pdf |
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Dwayne Surdu-Miller
Guest
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| Posted: Mon Jul 21, 2008 12:31 am Post subject: Re: Is a wood grain nose cone too UN-rocket? |
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One defunct rocketry manufacturer that offered all-wood kits was Stellar
Dimensions. A few of their plans are posted at Ye Olde Rocket Shoppe.
Dwayne Surdu-Miller
--------------------------------------
"Roger Coppock" <rcoppock@adnc.com> wrote in message
news:eff8353b-e0d0-4047-a400-54207256ec24@d19g2000prm.googlegroups.com...
On Jul 19, 8:23 am, Jonathan Sivier <jsiv...@illinois.edu> wrote:
| Quote: | On Fri, 18 Jul 2008 14:00:55 -0700 (PDT), Roger Coppock
rcopp...@adnc.com
wrote:
So, what to you think.
-- Is a wood grain nose cone too UN-rocket?
-- Should I hide true beauty under black paint just for the
sake of convention?
I think a wood grain nose cone could look very good. You may want to
change
the rest of the paint job to match it though.
There used to be someone selling rocket kits that were made entirely from
wood, including the body tubes.
|
Could you give the name of this defunct vendor and
other details, please.
<snip> |
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Joe Pfeiffer
Guest
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| Posted: Mon Jul 21, 2008 2:54 am Post subject: Re: Is a wood grain nose cone too UN-rocket? |
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Roger Coppock <rcoppock@adnc.com> writes:
| Quote: | Thanks Dwayne.
My nose cone and rocket have circular cross sections.
I don't see how this is on topic.
On Jul 20, 12:31 pm, "Dwayne Surdu-Miller"
surdumil...@shaw.nospam.ca> wrote:
One defunct rocketry manufacturer that offered all-wood kits was Stellar
Dimensions. A few of their plans are posted at Ye Olde Rocket Shoppe.
Dwayne Surdu-Miller
WOW! A square wooden rocket and directions with a short
Sci-Fi story included!?! Stellar Dimensions was more than
an E engine's flight from the mainstream. The available
directions are copyrighted 1996 through 1997. I wonder
how many of these rockets were made and how many survive
today?
|
Ah, square! Wondered about that 'wood body tube' part. The Ecee
rocket glider on this page uses a rectangular wooden body tube
http://members.aol.com/RobEdmonds/Edmonds.html
(there is an internal round tube used as part of the rocket glider
mechanism) |
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Dwayne Surdu-Miller
Guest
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| Posted: Mon Jul 21, 2008 9:34 am Post subject: Re: Is a wood grain nose cone too UN-rocket? |
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"Joe Pfeiffer" <pfeiffer@cs.nmsu.edu> wrote in message
news:1bvdz0b4rw.fsf@snowball.wb.pfeifferfamily.net...
| Quote: | Roger Coppock <rcoppock@adnc.com> writes:
Thanks Dwayne.
My nose cone and rocket have circular cross sections.
I don't see how this is on topic.
On Jul 20, 12:31 pm, "Dwayne Surdu-Miller"
surdumil...@shaw.nospam.ca> wrote:
One defunct rocketry manufacturer that offered all-wood kits was Stellar
Dimensions. A few of their plans are posted at Ye Olde Rocket Shoppe.
Dwayne Surdu-Miller
WOW! A square wooden rocket and directions with a short
Sci-Fi story included!?! Stellar Dimensions was more than
an E engine's flight from the mainstream. The available
directions are copyrighted 1996 through 1997. I wonder
how many of these rockets were made and how many survive
today?
Ah, square! Wondered about that 'wood body tube' part. The Ecee
rocket glider on this page uses a rectangular wooden body tube
http://members.aol.com/RobEdmonds/Edmonds.html
(there is an internal round tube used as part of the rocket glider
mechanism)
----------------------------------- |
Excellent recommendation, Joe!
And the Ecee Thunder is to die for. If you like acres of exposed woodgrain,
impressing at all stages of flight, it'll float your boat (Just make sure to
reinforce the canard though.)
Dwayne Surdu-Miller |
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Alan Jones
Guest
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| Posted: Mon Jul 21, 2008 2:08 pm Post subject: Re: Is a wood grain nose cone too UN-rocket? |
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On Sun, 20 Jul 2008 00:33:52 -0700 (PDT), Roger Coppock
<rcoppock@adnc.com> wrote:
| Quote: | What NACA research rockets were these?
|
Too many to mention. Many were built around surplus Recruit motors.
| Quote: | I may have a talent for modeling them.
Are there any histories, plans or scale data available?
|
Absolutely. In addition to many technical volumes, a number of
histories were also published.
| Quote: | With your color scheme some people might assume that it
originally had a black or yellow nose cone, but that you lost or
damaged it and replaced it with a balsa one.
This is quite true, but so long as my certification
judges don't make this mistake, I really don't care.
|
"Judges?" Certification is not a contest, you don't need to impress
them. It is a basic pass/fail evaluation. If you are trying to
impress them, you may be taking greater risks and fail. If your
"judges" are not competent, or are making you jump through hoops that
are not required, select new "judges".
Alan |
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Roger Coppock
Guest
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| Posted: Mon Jul 21, 2008 4:06 pm Post subject: Re: Is a wood grain nose cone too UN-rocket? |
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On Jul 21, 6:04 am, Alan Jones <ala...@nospam.mchsi.com> wrote:
| Quote: | On Sun, 20 Jul 2008 00:33:52 -0700 (PDT), Roger Coppock
rcopp...@adnc.com> wrote:
What NACA research rockets were these?
Too many to mention.
|
Name one NACA rocket with a wood grain nose
and give details, please.
Many were built around surplus Recruit motors.
Yes, there was, at least, a rocket motor named "Recruit."
According to the "Little Joe" article in Wikipedia:
Recruit rocket (Thiokol XM19)
Thrust: 37,500 lbf (167 kN)
Length: 2.7 m
Diameter: 0.23 m
Weight: 350 lb (159 kg)
Fuel: Solid
Burn Time: 1.53 s
However, there is no mention of wood grain nose cones. |
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plano-doug
Guest
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| Posted: Mon Jul 21, 2008 4:37 pm Post subject: Re: Is a wood grain nose cone too UN-rocket? |
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On Jul 20, 2:38 am, Roger Coppock <rcopp...@adnc.com> wrote:
| Quote: | Could you give the name of this defunct vendor and
other details, please.
|
The defunct vendor was Retro Rocket Works. They were distributed by
Apogee Rockets.
Here's a review of one:
http://www.rocketreviews.com/reviews/oop/rrw_spitfire.shtml
Here's an extract from Apogee's 2000 catalog (fingers crossed that the
link works):
http://home.flash.net/~samily/stuff/2000_Apogee_Retro.pdf
That's pretty much all I could find.
Doug
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Roger Coppock
Guest
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| Posted: Tue Jul 22, 2008 3:17 am Post subject: Re: Is a wood grain nose cone too UN-rocket? |
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SO, we now have TWO model rocket companies, each
making several kits with wood grain nose cones.
Maybe wood grain noses aren't so UN-rocket after
all?
On Jul 21, 9:37 am, plano-doug <doug_man_s...@yahoo.com> wrote:
Thank you, Doug!
| Quote: | On Jul 20, 2:38 am, Roger Coppock <rcopp...@adnc.com> wrote:
Could you give the name of this defunct vendor and
other details, please.
The defunct vendor was Retro Rocket Works. They were distributed by
Apogee Rockets.
Here's a review of one
|
http://www.rocketreviews.com/reviews/oop/rrw_spitfire.shtml
| Quote: |
Here's an extract from Apogee's 2000 catalog (fingers crossed that the
link works):
|
http://home.flash.net/~samily/stuff/2000_Apogee_Retro.pdf
Just set the coordinates on the TARDIS to minus 8 years,
and I could certify with one of these three Retro Rocket
Works kits. I like the lines of "Jules Verne 29." At
$115.00 in year 2000 dollars, the price is a little steep,
but, what the hay, it's a thing of beauty.
| Quote: |
That's pretty much all I could find.
Doug
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Alan Jones
Guest
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| Posted: Tue Jul 22, 2008 7:53 am Post subject: Re: Is a wood grain nose cone too UN-rocket? |
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On Mon, 21 Jul 2008 09:06:09 -0700 (PDT), Roger Coppock
<rcoppock@adnc.com> wrote:
| Quote: | On Jul 21, 6:04 am, Alan Jones <ala...@nospam.mchsi.com> wrote:
On Sun, 20 Jul 2008 00:33:52 -0700 (PDT), Roger Coppock
rcopp...@adnc.com> wrote:
What NACA research rockets were these?
Too many to mention.
Name one NACA rocket with a wood grain nose
and give details, please.
Many were built around surplus Recruit motors.
Yes, there was, at least, a rocket motor named "Recruit."
According to the "Little Joe" article in Wikipedia:
Recruit rocket (Thiokol XM19)
Thrust: 37,500 lbf (167 kN)
Length: 2.7 m
Diameter: 0.23 m
Weight: 350 lb (159 kg)
Fuel: Solid
Burn Time: 1.53 s
However, there is no mention of wood grain nose cones.
|
Try a search engine like Google, rather than Wikipedia. I'd suggest
searching for NACA histories, or NACA research rockets. You may not
have much luck searching for wood grain nose cones directly. The
materials used in many of NACA's research rockets (e.g. wood) was not
considered significant to the test objectives. Shape was most
important, while cost, weight, and fabrication time were also factors,
the material used was hardly worth mentioning.
I'd be surprised if Little Joe ever lofted a wooden space capsule mock
up. To properly test the escape system you want something as close to
actual flight hardware as possible. |
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